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Round 7
|
Walter
|
Phila, Pa
|
|
After following your article (daily), I was a bit
disappointed with the TV Program. Once again the book is
better than the movie -- I mean TV program
|
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Marlin, LTC (Ret)
|
New Orleans LA
|
|
Thank you for honoring these men with their story. Please update
your Who's who with PV2 Anton Berendsen, SSG Daniel Busch
(KIA), 1LT Tom DiTomasso, Fillmore (KIA), Houston (KIA), J. Martin
(KIA), LTC Tom Matthews, SGT Jim Smith (KIA), SPC Derek
Velasco & Howard Wasdin.
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
The Who's Who is meant to help the reader keep
track of all the names of people in the story.
We've been updating it with the series, not
listing characters until they appear in the
narrative. Characters who appear only once or
twice and are not mentioned again won't be listed.
I realize that there were many, many more men
involved in the fight than those named in these
stories. More will be in the book.
MB
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Rick
|
Raleigh, NC
|
|
Pt 3 Bradleys: Armor is vulnerable in cities to HEAVY
ANTITANK WEAPONS, like Chechens used, but not so much to
RPG's. Bradleys can dismount troops to clear danger areas on
foot, tanks can't. Bottom line: Bradleys would have saved
lives. Less supressive fire would be needed (you can ignore
guys with AK's) so civilian deaths would have been less.
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Roy W. Berry
|
Frederick ,Maryland
|
|
Have you covered anything about what the Signal Corps did? I
was responsable for the Installation, Operations and
Maintance of the 1st Mobile Gateway Communications shelter.
We provided E-MAIL to the Troops. Also kept folks up on the
status of the Phillies!
SFC Roy W. Berry (USA RET)
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
I have no doubt your services were much
appreciated by the men and women there. Mike
Durant did tell me about how much he appreciated
the e-mail outlet. He and his wife were in the
middle of building a house when he was deployed.
Mrs. Durant got stuck with being the
subcontractor. Thanks to your efforts, he was able
to at least coach from afar.
MB
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Rick
|
Raleigh, NC
|
|
Terminology note: "Commando" is a South African term from
the Boer War, or a British Royal Marine unit. It has been
corrupted in the popular press to refer to members of elite
units. Better terminology is Delta or Seal operators and
Rangers, highest praise to an Army fighting man is to call
him a soldier, also the greatest insult to a SEAL or Marine
:-).
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks. I'll try to watch it.
MB
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Craig
|
Media, PA
|
|
I've heard there is a TV special also, if so when, what channel?
Great work, I don't think any of us really knew how bad this fight was.
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
The documentary aired in Philadelphia on Tuesday
night, Dec. 2, 1997. No air date has been set
nationally yet, but it will be shown nationally.
You can inquire about ordering a tape by emailing
the producer at chris.mills@phillynews.com
MB
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Craig
|
Media, PA
|
|
I just read some of the Q & A sections and answered my own question about the TV show, will it air again? Thanks
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Booth Jameson
|
Wash., D.C.
|
|
Riviting column -- can't wait to see it on TV. Question:
why didn't the "second column" have gunship escort?
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Gunships were pretty busy holding off the mobs
closing on the two crash sites. At that point in
the fight TFR was overextended.
MB
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Fred Wendt
|
Commerce, GA
|
|
I am very impressed with this journalistic endeavor. The
sophisticated weaving of story, graphics, images, pictures,
and media in your presentation establishes a new mark for
serious electronic publication on the Web. I truly
appreciate your "team's" efforts with this series.
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thank you very much. Jennifer Musser is the
web site editor. She's the best.
MB
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Curious
|
Atlanta, GA
|
|
Did Delta do anything wrong? Where was their officer leadership? Did they make any decisions? It sounds as if you are on their payroll.
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Keep reading. I welcome checks in the mail, but so
far none from the D-boys.
MB
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JP
|
Vero Beach, Florida
|
|
There have been several questions regarding the legality of
noncombatants getting injured. Would you review US Army
Field Manual 27-2 "Your Conduct in Combat Under the Laws of
War" and Field Manual 27-10 "The Law of Land Warfare"?(Cont)
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JP
|
Vero Beach, Florida
|
|
(Cont)There was not a violation of the laws concerning
warfare by the actions of the US Troops.If this is discussed
in the book could you also mention the war crimes trial for
the Canadian Airborne troops who did commit atrocities?
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Mark Bowden
|
|
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If I do, I will.
MB
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Mark Mondl
|
Beavercreek
|
|
"In a battle, fought on 3 October 1993, Major Generals
Thomas Montgomery and William Garrison's lack of
war-fighting skills caused 18 American warriors
to be killed, 100 more to be wounded and our nation to be
humiliated. Garrison and Montgomery made every basic error
in the book, beginning with not understanding the enemy.
They had bad intelligence, were overly dependent on
firepower and technology and were arrogant. Nor did they
bother to put a go-to-hell-plan in place in case the shit
hit the fan," said Col David Hackworth. You mentioned Gen
Garrison, but not Gen Montgomery. What was his role and
what happened to him?
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
General Montgomery was in command of the Quick
Reaction Force (10th Mountain Division), which
will be riding to the rescue here in a few days --
although the guys from Ft. Drum can't wait.
Montgomery was second-in-command of the UN
military operation, but was not in the direct
chain of command for Task Force Ranger. I plan
to briefly address Col. Hackworth's points in
notes at the end of my book, which will be
published by Grove/Atlantic in Fall, 1998.
MB
|
|
North Andrew
|
Metro Manila, Philippines
|
|
Great job! Really exciting and very vivid! (I can almost
here the gunshots) Always looking forward to the next
chapter. Has the film/documentary come out yet? I only hope
they show it over here. More power!
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks. For a videotape you can email the producer
at chris.mills@phillynews.com
MB
|
|
AKACOP
|
HIGHLANDS RANCH, CO.
|
|
COL.DAVID, I WAS IN A CO 214 INF. 2ND PT. I ASKED THE SAME QUESTION EARILER. WE TALKED OFTEN IN SOMALIA AND AGAIN WHEN THE BUILDING WAS DEDICATED TO MARTIN. PLEASE E- MAIL ME AT AKACOP@AOL.COM A-CO ALSO HAS ITS OWN WEP PAGE/CHAT ROOM AND NEWS LETTER. TRY TO GET IN TOUCH. HEY, MARK YOUR PICTURES ARE ON THE WAY SORRY ABOUT THE DELAY.
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thought you forgot me. Thanks.
MB
|
|
Semper Fi
|
Alexandria, VA
|
|
Are there some M 1 or M 60 drivers that can comment on the
survivability of such tanks hit by RPGs? As I recall,
unless a tread was hit directly the tank wouldn't suffer
damage of any consequence. They would have certainly
experienced less damage than the Hummers.
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
In Chechnya, as I understand it, armor of various
types proved disastrously vulnerable to tread
hits.
MB
|
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John Coyle
|
Haddonfield, NJ
|
|
You and the paper are to be commended for the series and the
site. Never read anything more compelling in the papers. I
only hope this experience and the exposure your series has
given it inform the decisions of those who would send young
men to their deaths for no reason, but it appears we never
learn.
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks, John.
MB
|
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seth rodgers
|
mantua, n.j
|
|
How would I go about obtaining copies of this article in
it's entirety? I have kept up to date on all articles except
chapters 8 and 9. How can I get those?
|
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
You can read all the chapters on this web site,
which you obviously found. For a reprint of the
entire series on paper, you can order by calling
215-854-4984.
MB
You can read Chapter 8 and Chapter 9 by clicking on the chapter names in this sentence. The contents of this web site are listed on the Site Index. -- Online ed.
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Brad Colip
|
Greenfield, IN
|
|
I find it hard to believe that an RPG will take out an
Abrams or even a Bradley, but I am checking some of my
sources. I remember watching the Waco hearings on CSPAN
when a Senator remarked that there were more armor assets in
Waco than in Mog.
|
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Probably a correct statement.
MB
|
|
Dudley Bokoski
|
Greensboro, NC
|
|
After reading how horrific the battle was, I'm struck by how
little in-depth news coverage there was of the event at the
time especially contrasted with coverage of the Pueblo
incident or the marine barracks bombing in Lebanon (similar
small-scale fiascos). The the media lack the knowledge to
do the story or did they gloss it over because most approved
of the mission itself?
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
I'm not sure, Dudley. One problem was there
weren't any American reporters in Mogadishu (to my
knowledge) when the battle happened. Those who
arrived a day or two later were preoccupied with
covering the ongoing story of Mike Durant, who was
being held captive. Task Force Ranger was strictly
off limits to the press, and reporting in
Mogadishu is tough. Nevertheless, Rick Atkinson of
The Washington Post wrote a remarkably accurate
account of the battle for that newspaper soon
after it happened. Events move swiftly in
international news, and newspapers and TV stations
tend to be far more interested in what's happening
today than what happened last week, or last month.
So when a story slips by, as this one did, few
reporters are inclined to go back months or years
later to sort it out. I've found that it is better
with some stories to wait a while. Off-limit
sources tend to become available, and the people
directly involved become more accessible and
willing to talk. In this case, many of those I
interviewed had left the military -- including
Colin Powell. Nevertheless, there were many who
asked me when I started working on this story,
"Who is going to read a story about a battle four
years old?" I had just finished reading "Son of
the Morning Star" and "We Were Soldiers Once and
Young," battles that took place a century and more
than 30 years ago, respectively.
MB
|
|
Ward Good
|
Richmond, Va
|
|
Wonderful, horrible account of failed mission. Thank You.
Why so few officers in the fray? Were they not involved or
not willing to speak to you?
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
I reported the story from the ground up, first
because it was hard to get officers to talk to me,
and second because that's the story I wanted to
tell. Ranking officers on the ground were Capt.
Mike Steele, the Ranger commander, Capt. Scott
Miller, the Delta commander, and Lt. Col. Danny
McKnight. I have interviewed Steele, but have been
unable to interview Miller or McKnight. If either
of you guys reads this and would like to talk to
me, my number is 215-854-2400. Thanks for the
compliment, Ward.
MB
|
|
Jim
|
Guelzow
|
|
I was a 10th MTN 2-14 INF 60 gunner attached to a Special Ops team at Wolcott's crash site. I like the story so far and am looking forward to where 2-14 comes into play. Even through all this, the basic light infantry does not get respect when attending the "elite" schools, i.e. Ranger school. Good job... guelzow@frontiernet.net
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks, Jim. The 10th MTN will make its
appearance, though the series will not give it the
full treatment it deserves. I'll have more space
in the book. I would like to talk to you.
Please give me a call if you can at 215-854-2400.
MB
|
|
Jim Guelzow
|
Victor, NY
|
|
Has Delta John responded? I was a 2-14 INF 60 gunner that linked up with a Special Ops team and have an award recommendation letter from a "John". It's impessive to hear what actually went on before we were called in. Again, great job on the story. guelzow@frontiernet.net
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks again. Delta John weighs in now and then,
and is most welcome. He has not called me.
MB
|
|
Armor
|
|
|
Bradley = Death. There are 3 firing ports on each side for
shortened versions of the M16, a death-dealing 25mm cannon
(cannon = exploding bodies), and a M2 .50cal/M240G 7.62
(whatever tickles your fancy). It can run people over too.
|
|
Curious
|
|
|
RE: Hackworth(less) - I'm positive Hackworthless could have
come up with a better plan - capture all the bad guys -
feed everybody - then take the afternoon off. In
Hackworthless new book you can also read the helicopters
arn't worth anything. To those who like to quote him - make
sure he is quoted to the fullest extent.
|
|
Correction
|
|
|
Ref: Chapter 18. One more item was in the hawk that went
down. I have no proof of this, but Dowdy must have left
something just before the crash when he noticed he didn't
have his seat belt on. I do know what he will be getting
for Christmas this year!
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|
Wayne Karvonen
|
Olympia, WA
|
|
Great series. Happy to finally hear from people who were
there, and what really happened. Gordon was a friend from
back in our 10th Grp days, a real hard charger and great
soldier. As were all the others there that day.
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks Wayne. I'd like to learn more about Gary
for the book. Call me if you get a chance at
215-854-2400.
MB
|
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EwLjr
|
Fort Campbell, KY
|
|
Great Story! For those of us with slow computers is there an FTP to download the series and read later.
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks.
MB
No FTP site as yet. We're just trying to keep up with Mark around here. -- Online ed.
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Tom Anderson
|
Arlington Heights, IL
|
|
How do I get a copy of this? My son Steve Anderson is on his way to Ft. Benning for a reunion with John Burns and Kenni Thomas. I'd like a copy to give each of them for x-mas. - make that 5 copies. Anderson, Thomas, Goodale, Sizemore and Burns. I'll pay for it - 847-394-8858
|
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Copies of the whole series will be available a
week or two after it finishes up -- maybe not
fast enough for Christmas. Call 215-854-4984. If
you have problems there, try Sally Downey at
215-854-2913.
MB
|
|
SSgt P.L. Smith
|
Bogue Field, NC
|
|
During a "hit" by USMC Force Recon, a Direct Action Platoon
(DAP) is used as a covering force. On stand by is a platoon
and company sized force, in case things go bad. Is this SOP
for Delta and the Rangers, why was it not utilized? Would
have saved alot of lives.
|
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
I can't answer this, but I'm sure some of those
reading can.
MB
|
|
Link, Ronald L.
|
Humble, Texas
|
|
My son was one of the D-Boys and was at the Wocott crash
site. He survied. Where in hell was the command leadership?
Was it good old inter-service rivalry?
|
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Keep reading. Rivalry created a situation on the
ground that, while I don't think it killed
anybody, caused a problem.
MB
|
|
CPT M
|
|
|
Mark;
The comments you are making pertaining to 2-14IN comming
into the fight "at the end" implies all the wrong
things...It was a long, long night. Glad Dragon6, and my
XO are also watching, look forward to talking to you.
|
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
I apologize for any mistakes. I look forward to
talking to you guys and learning more.
MB
|
|
m skala
|
Huntsville, AL
|
|
I was a member of the Ranger Task force. I am trying to collect things from our mission there, so later in life i can look back on our 40 hour fight for our lives. Can you help me? Thank you
|
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
I could probably help put you in touch with other
guys. Call me at 215-854-2400.
MB
|
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tp
|
ny,ny
|
|
I am very sad to hear that Matt Rierson is no longer alive.
What happened? BTW, superb job M.B. It's abouut time someone
gave a damn.
|
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Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thank you. Matt was killed in a mortar attack
several days after the battle.
MB
|
|
Bill
|
Monterey
|
|
Mark,
I'm probably the millionth guy to tell you this, but there
is no way to fire M203 (40mm) grenade from a SAW. The
Grenade launcher is designed to mount on the underside of
an M16 rifle. It cannot be mounted on an M249 SAW.
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
My mistake. I probably should have gone into the
Army as my Dad suggested when I got out of high
school. I never expected to be writing about
battles. I've corrected the mistake, and thanks for
pointing it out.
MB
|
|
Bill
|
Monterey
|
|
Mark,
If Yurek was indeed a SAW gunner, he may have borrowed an
M203 from another soldier for that shot. Also, some
Somali's had old (Vietnam era) M79 grenade launchers. They
fire the same 40mm round as the M203. I read of at least
one American in Somalia (a Marine I think) that confiscated
and used an M79.
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
It appears that the 203 was mounted under the
barrel of some of the M16 and CAR15s. Yurek, I'm
sure, had an M16.
MB
|
|
skm
|
|
|
MB this is good stuff. I was there and have total admiration for the "shooters", they are the countries finest. I would like to mention that my men performed flawlessly to insure that A/C were TOT + or - 30 seconds. FARRP team. Those men kept bullets coming, changed mini's and pumped gas. Is there any mention in the book about the FARRP?
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
I'm afraid I got lost back there in the blizzard
of acronyms. Please call me and help sort it out.
215-854-2400. You don't have to say your name.
MB
|
|
Nick Mackenzie
|
Salinas,CA
|
|
Excellent contribution to military history. Important
education on capabilities, limitations and vulnerabilities
of military operations in urban terrain. A testament to
warriors who sacrifice for our survival. They have given
more than we deserve.
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thank you very much.
MB
|
|
DJ
|
Gig Harbor, WA
|
|
Mark, you mentioned a possible collaboration with the
Sammies by the Italians? Can you elaborate? Is it time to
put them on my list which includes the French (because of
the '86 Libya mission)? Also, can you tell me which agency
produced the battle video? Thanks
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Several of the soldiers who lived at the hangar
told me of their suspicions that the Italians, who
were based uphill from the TFR hangar and had a
clear view inside, would flash headlights on
vehicles whenever a mission was gearing up. This
is hardly solid evidence. I do know from some of
the memo traffic from TFR command and CENTCOM
that there was concern about Italians giving aid
to Somalis. In Mogadishu, the Habr Gidr leaders I
spoke with all spoke warmly of the help they
received from their former Colonial masters.
The battle video was taped by reconnaissance helicopters, which are modified Little Birds. The P-3 Orion flying above Mogadishu also filmed the raid and subsequent battle with its high-powered telescopic cameras.
MB
|
|
JB
|
Dayton, OH
|
|
Small typo "Nelson pointed up the street, and Yurek edged
out to look around the car. He saw three dead Somalis in
the dirt. He 'stacking' them into a little mound."
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks. We've fixed it.
MB
|
|
Kim Langley
|
Herndon, VA
|
|
Mark: Ref some tech details on the RPG. RPG-7 (HEAT) rounds
do have a automatic self-destruct mechanism. They self
destruct at about 900 meters. I know, I tested them myself
in the Kuwait Desert after Desert Storm. Also, the RPG will
penetrate the top turrent of a Type 59 (Chicom T-55) tank,
so my guess is they would do a job on a Bradley. RPG is a
very effective and easy to use weapon. You really have to
respect it. Keep up the good work
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks, Kim. A gunner informs me that "The Skinnies messed
with the warhead on the RPG to air burst. I saw a
lot of them go off in the air."
MB
|
|
JB
|
Dayton
|
|
Regarding GMB from NJ and your response to him. "Fast
Movers" is generally slang for high performance jet aircraft
that deliver ground support/suppression fire. Term
originated in Vietnam with F-4s delivery HE and Napalm. Now
refers to F-16s, F-15Es, F/A-18s.
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks. There were none over Mog to my knowledge.
MB
|
|
Don McKeon
|
Dulles, VA
|
|
Dear Mr. Bowden: I am the editorial director at Brassey's, Inc., a publisher of books primarily on military topics. Do you have a book publisher for your outstanding series? If not, our editorial advisory board might be interested in considering it. Could you drop me an e-mail or call at 703-260-0602, ext. 16? Thanks. Sincerely, Don McKeon
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks, Don. I do have a publisher,
Grove/Atlantic, and the book is scheduled to
appear in the Fall of 1998. I'll give you a call
to thank you for your interest personally.
MB
|
|
Micael Carlsson
|
Sweden
|
|
Excellent reading!! Were the Swedish field hospital involved
in taking care of the wounded? I went home from Somalia
in march -93 and is very interrested in the hospitals
history after that.
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
I don't know the answer to that. I do plan to talk
to some of the docs involved, and they'll know. So
check the book. Thanks Micael. It's great to know
the series is being seen internationally.
MB
|
|
David
|
Chicago, Illinois
|
|
The most well written account of battle I have ever read.
I heard about this incident but never realized how large
and horrible it really was.
How many parts will this series be... when will it be
completed?
THIS SHOULD BE A MOVIE GUYS...
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thank you very much David, although there are
plenty of terrific battle stories out there. The
series will have 30 parts, and will end Dec. 14th,
at which point I will get to work finishing the
book, which will cover about three times more
ground.
MB
|
|
Redleg
|
Edison, NJ
|
|
Rick from NC is right on w/ Armor tactics. I will post longer
detail of an added benefit in forum. Concerning M79s, saw
many in the documentary, shoulder and truck mounted. RPGs, even t7s, RARELY penetrate the armor tanks.
An old T-55 which has already been brewed and the metal
brittled, MIGHT have its turret punctered if hit right. Cforum.
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Thanks. I'd like to see you guys work this out.
MB
|
|
DTD
|
Newburgh, NY
|
|
Mark how you doing? I hope Yurek didn't tell you that he
had a M203 mounted to a SAW, And I say a saw because I
assure you he may have picked a saw up but he didn,t carry
one.Anybody that knows a saw knows you can't mount a 203 on
it. COME ON YUREK!!!
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
Don't blame Ed. My mistake, Dave. Your videotape
will be in the mail soon.
MB
|
|
"Vitto"
|
Charlottesville, VA
|
|
Ok I'm gonna rant here. All this talk of whether or not an
RPG can take out a M1 or Bradley is pointless. The
indisputable fact is they provide more protection than a
damn HUMMV or 5 ton. Thus, that Gen.'s reasoning about the
experience in Chechneya is assinine. Also, as an ex-anti-
tank gunner in 1st/RGR BN, I'll attest it ain't easy to
take out armor with an unguided weapon. (cont)
|
|
Lock
|
Somerville, NJ
|
|
Mark: Out of curiosity, was SOCOM supportive of your efforts to write this story? Which military organizations/units were most cooperative?
|
|
Mark Bowden
|
|
|
The public affairs people for USSOC set up
interviews for me with about 10 Rangers at Ft.
Benning and with Mike Durant, Keith Jones and Mike
Goffena. This was an enormous help and really
opened the door for me. After that I got the
impression they were tired of all my questions and
requests, and stopped helping. They refused
numerous requests to do videotaped interviews or
to let us photograph key people still in the
military, and would not help us with file photos.
My efforts to obtain documents through official
channels was effectively and politely stonewalled
on all fronts. We were given a few minutes of the
hours of videotape of the battle, most of it
fairly useless to us (they are, as I understand
it, protecting some of the capabilities), a few
snippets of good stuff. Many of those I wanted to
talk to were special ops people and very busy. But the leads I got from the arranged
interviews really launched me, and I started
having lots of success getting to people and
documents on my own. The Air Force public affairs
people knocked themselves out trying to help me.
Since the stories have started running there has
been a general and wonderful thaw on the Army
front, and I'm getting help again, for which I am
grateful.
MB
|
|
"Vitto"
|
Charlottesville, VA
|
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(Cont)You have to hit it in just the right spot. Also,
armor provides that all important intimidation factor.
Trucks and Jeeps don't scare people. We slept better at
night when we had a Sheridan attached to my team when we
were hunting for rennegade PDF in Panama. And there lies
the rub, this administration didn't learn the lesson of
Vietnam (how could they) namely, when committing troops you
must also committ overwhelming force (as in Panama and
Iraq).(Cont)
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"Vitto"
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Charlottesville, VA
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(cont)I'm not saying that armor should have been in on the
intial part of the mission, necessarily. But it damn well
should have been in country in the event a mission went to
hell, as this one did. This isn't MMQBing it's basic
military tactics (which our CIC has no concept of). Great
series MB. If you get a hold of Dale tell him I said hi.
Sorry for the long post. RLTW! out!
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Mark Bowden
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Thanks.
MB
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Abdi
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Alex, VA
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Very telling story! Having worked with 4th and 8th PSYOPS
from Ft. Bragg in the first six months of this operation, I
believed the blueprint of peace was underway for this
country. As a Somali, I did everything to chip in—from
working 14 hour shifts to travelling throughout the country,
bridging the cultural gap between these alien looking
soldiers and my very inquisitive countrymen. Little did I
know in six months later, I would see the picture of US
soldiers being dragged in the same, peaceful alleys I used
to play hide and seek, while innocent Somalis were getting
mowed down by soldiers who did not know as to why they were
in this "god-forsaken" place.
The blame as to why Somalia descended into this purgatory
and aspiring soldiers and innocent Somalis lost their lives
completely rests upon the shoulders of any U.S. government.
It is doing that now as it arms one country against another,
then in five years they will send aspiring U.S. soldiers to
face the same U.S. made bullets.
Thank you Mark.
Regards,
Abdi
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Mark Bowden
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Thank you, Abdi. It is good to hear your
perspective.
MB
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MAJ Lock
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Somerville, NJ
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Accepting that what you have reported is true, I find it disturbing to read that there appear to have been a number of Rangers--associated with the convoys in particular—who seemed to shirk their duties in regards to assisting with the defense of themselves and their comrades. It should not come as a surprise to any member of the 75th Ranger Regiment, Special Ops, or 82nd Airborne community to find themselves in the thick of things—though the savagery of this particular engagement was obviously unexpected. But that’s why they/we volunteer for such units. Was there a trend regarding who they were? It does not surprise me that the Delta and SEAL members all actively participated. For the most part, they are older, more experienced, Ranger School graduates, groomed on a more individual scale. The younger Rangers, on the other hand, are not as fortunate. Were the Rangers in question junior in rank, SGT and below, and were any graduates of the US Army Ranger School? From a commander’s perspective, this is a serious question, especially for such an elite unit. Identifying a pattern or trend could lead to eventual solutions to rectify the problem—as SLA Marshall demonstrated for
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MAJ Lock
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Somerville, NJ
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(last part cut off from my previously long messsage): ...the Army community decades ago. Thanks. PS: for anyone believing I am questioning the bravery of the men of Task Force Ranger, I have nothing but the most profound respect and admiration for my fellow members of the profession of arms.
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Mark Bowden
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I believe the overwhelming majority of Rangers and 10th Mountain Division soldiers fought very bravely and well in Mogadishu. I
suspect that it is unrealistic in any vicious
firefight to expect that every man will summon the
courage to do as well. That so many of these
soldiers did is a tribute to their training as
well as their heroism. I also suspect that some
who distinguished themselves could, on another
day, fail. Some of those who did heroic things
that day have told me they don't really know why
they did, or if they could do so again in the same
circumstances. I don't know how I would react. It
does seem to me that the age, experience and
training of the D-boys and SEALs really showed. In
many instances they seem to have held things
together -- although some of them need to work on
their "people" skills. I did hear of several
Delta operators who, according to their
fellows, appeared to have "fogged out" in the
fight. The very few Rangers who didn't do well
(either refused orders or stopped fighting)were at
the sergeant level, but there were so few of them
that I doubt the sample is statistically
relevant.
MB
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gordon
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ft benning, ga
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I want to ask Mark Mondl...What is his area of expertise?
This guy makes some pretty bold statements about Maj Gnrl
Bill Garrison.
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gordon
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ft benning, ga
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The question made to you today by Maj Lock is the reason for
my original comments and questions. This man draws the
conclusion from your story that Rangers "shirked their
responsibilities". I assume (to ask him) that he's coming to
this assumption by comments you made in the article to the
effect "the Rangers were shaken to a man", and the "D-boys
were like machines, they were already rearmed and ready to
go back out". Other things you wrote about how the Rangers
were afraid to pickup their own wounded and how the combat
hardened "D-boys" held the convoy together. Lets clarify for
Maj Locks (and those like him) sake...in combat their never
is anybody (including the d-boys) who is not shaken to a
man, and those that say they aren't shaken or scared is
lying. Not to hammer him but, this is the danger that can
cloud the story for those who are not in the know.
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Mark Bowden
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I agree. Every sane man in battle is scared. The
Rangers I interviewed were, to a man, deeply
impressed by the D-boys and SEALs, and, yes, they
did refer to them as "like machines." By this I
think they meant that the older, more experienced
men seemed very skilled at rising above their
fear, and functioning cooly in terrifying and
confusing situations. Many of the Rangers did the
same.
MB
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Dave
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NJ
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How many chapters do you anticipate? This is
outstanding! Great job!
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Mark Bowden
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Thirty. Thanks.
MB
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D.M. Kennedy
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Thousand Oaks, CA
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Gen Garrison's post-op statements should be regarded with
skepticism. He was wrong. Either he didn't try hard enough to convince the CinC or was excessively gung-ho/go it alone. In any case, force protection was his responsibility.
Vulnerability of Hummers vs better survivability of better
armored vehicles was ultimately, tragically, demonstrated.
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D.M. Kennedy
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Thousand Oaks, CA
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I saw two versions of the photo of a dead American. One (in Germany) naked, the other (in the US) with shorts. The photos are virtually identical. I suspect the photographer "staged" the body covering in order to sell to an American market. I would find that to be morally repugnant. Do you have any information on this?
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Mark Bowden
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I have heard this from others. The photographer
was Paul Watson of the Toronto Star. I have not
spoken to him.
MB
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Kevin Berry
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Fremont, CA
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Have you already written all 30 newspaper chapters? If so,
how has the real-time Q&A feature affected your
writing? Thanks for your efforts.
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Mark Bowden
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I've still got the last chapter to write, and have
been writing the final chapters while the first
have run. I originally told the editors here that
I would finish in mid-December. They wanted to get
it started earlier. Answering all these questions
has been a pleasant distraction, although if the
number keeps growing at this pace, I might not be
able to keep up. My editors insist that finishing
the series is more important than answering your
questions. The nerve.
MB
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Scott Riney
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Littleton, Colorado
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A quick correction for JPD: RPG-7 rounds have a time destruct fuze if they don't hit anything. What effect that would have on returning rounds in the AA role, I don't know.
Would the men in the "Lost Convoy" who were still mobile have been better off on foot, instead of packed into Humvees?
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Mark Bowden
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With a clear objective and route, they might have
been better off on foot. Although the Rangers and
D-boys who ran from the target house to the crash
site, some five blocks, had two men killed and
about eight injured en route.
MB
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Myles K. Bartley
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Boston, MA
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Excellent job! Your story is great! I'm very excited
that the individuals involved finally received the
recognition that they deserve. As a former PL, C/1-75,
'93-94, I can tell you we were all shocked by that day and
ticked off we weren't there to help. Keep up the
excellent work!
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Mark Bowden
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Thanks, Myles.
MB
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Jimbo
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Everywhere
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Great series keep it up. Two quick questions how long will this series be posted after it ends ? and how many of these soldiers still remain with the military ?
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Mark Bowden
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Thanks. Indefinitely. Don't know.
MB
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john
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fayetteville,nc
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how have you verified what people have told you about
events of 3 oct?
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Mark Bowden
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I have interviewed at this point about 70 of the men who were on the ground that night. Many of their accounts overlap. Wherever more than one person has described the same event to me, in the same way, I consider it to be verified. I also have an official list of the injuries received, which serves as further hard evidence. Lastly, I have many of the accounts -- written either by soldiers in the fight or recorded after interviews with them in the days following the battle. Against that, I have several official Army accouunts of the battle in varying degrees of detail, and of course, the transcript of the command net. All of these things together have created the body of this narrative.
MB
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SH
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King of Prussia, PA
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Mark,
I know that Delta Sniper Jim Smith was mentioned briefly as having been shot but there was never anything more mentioned after that. As his neighbor in NJ, I would like to know the real details of his tragic passing but would never actually ask any of his family members (too distressing). Do you have any more details about him? Thanks a lot
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Mark Bowden
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Keep reading.
MB
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L.H. Burruss
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Columbia SC
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D.M. Kennedy & Hackworth's unequivocal declarations about MG Garrison's decisions, when neither was there, are as ludicrous as it would be for someone to intimate that Gen Colin Powell could not have succeeded in the Army on his own merit without affirmative action. The troops know, and -- one assumes -- will be heard. Weren't the armor and AC-130s asked for and denied? One should not confuse Garrison's "no excuse, sir" attitude during subsequent hearings and his assumption of full responsibility for the actions of himself and his subordinates, (instead of pointing a finger elsewhere, as is the norm in our society these days) with how he might have employed those assets had they been available.
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