Speaking at a forum in Old City sponsored by the Action Alliance for Senior Citizens, both men promised to protect the 20 percent discount that seniors get on their Philadelphia Gas Works bills. And both promised to look into ways of improving the ParaTransit system that many seniors rely on to get around the city.

Debating later at another forum - this one at Drexel University sponsored by two business groups, Greater Philadelphia First and the Pennsylvania Economy League - the candidates sought to underline their pro-business attitudes.

Street, who, as the North Philadelphia Democrat, had the harder task of selling himself to the crowd, reminded the CEOs, CFOs and vice presidents that he had been "tried and tested" as City Council president and partner of Mayor Rendell in fixing the city's finances.

"I won't do anything to affect the fiscal integrity of this city," he said.

Katz repeated his campaign mantra that, despite the good news from the Rendell years, the city's continuing population loss under Rendell means "we're in a boat that, in large measure, is continuing to sink."

About 50 people showed up for the 45-minute seniors event in Old City. Some were agitated that they wouldn't have more time to grill the candidates on pet issues.

"If we can't ask questions, come election time, we might just stay home," shouted one senior, who stormed out of the meeting before it ended.

Street used the occasion to tout his record of service to seniors as a City Council member, especially getting elderly residents discounts on water, gas and tax bills.

"I turn on my television one day and I see my Republican opponent in one of his nice, glossy advertisements advising senior citizens to take advantage of that tax freeze on your assessment," Street said. "Do you know whose bill that was? Do you know who did that for you? I did."

Despite the candidates' disagreements over public education, the Republican and Democrat spent most of the forum agreeing with each other on key senior issues.

They agreed that there are problems with the ParaTransit program, about which the Action Alliance's vice president James Jordan said seniors have "plenty of horror stories." Both Katz and Street pledged to work closely with SEPTA to improve the system.

Both candidates also pledged to keep the 20 percent discount that 93,000 seniors get off their gas bills - and both agreed that income guidelines should be enacted to ensure that only needy seniors get the break.

"There isn't any reason for wealthy Philadelphia senior citizens to have that discount," Katz said.

Street concurred, citing the story of one senior resident who made $400,000 a year and got the discounted gas bill.

"In just a few years, after I have finished serving two terms as mayor, I will be eligible for the senior citizen discount at PGW," he said, to some giggles in the crowd. "But I shouldn't be getting it. My pension should be more than enough to take care of me and my family."

At the business forum at Drexel, Street sought to reassure the business leaders that he could be trusted. He noted that during the explosive situations after the Rodney King trial and riots in Los Angeles and during the more recent Grays Ferry controversy, he had worked with Rendell to avert conflict between the races.

He also noted that in the 1980s as a council member, he had helped put together the votes that "had defeated proposals to increase wage taxes and real estate taxes."

Street also said that during the city's fiscal crisis in the early 1990s, he had helped to lead the city's unions "to make a number of very significant concessions."

"I'm the only person running for mayor in this room who has ever reduced a tax," Street told the businesspeople.

Katz responded that Street, in addition to being the only candidate in the room to ever reduce a tax, was "also the only candidate in the room who has ever raised taxes - 18 times."

Katz has proposed cutting the wage tax from 4.61 percent to 4 percent, a move criticized by Street as too drastic. The Republican candidate said the Rendell/Street tax cut efforts amounted to "very insignificant tax reduction."

He said that on Street's watch, people had left the city "at a faster clip than Chicago, New York and at any other time in the city's history."

Responding to a question from moderator Larry Kane, the KYW-Channel 3 anchor, on why the city should put up so much money for a new Eagles stadium when the Eagles only play 11 times a year and Veterans Stadium could be refurbished more cheaply, both candidates said they favor a new stadium.

Katz said that if the issue has not been resolved by Rendell before he becomes mayor, he will require private interests to put up "substantially more" of the new stadiums' cost.

An expert on the financing of sports facilities, Katz was critical of Rendell's negotiations with the Eagles. "Starting this negotiation off by offering two-thirds of the money was probably not the right place to start," he said.

Street said he favors the football stadium but doesn't think the city should have to pick up the entire "local share" of the local-state-private financing package.

Katz said that any effort to tap the suburbs for stadium money beyond the funds already allocated by the state was liable to spoil city efforts to extract new funds from Harrisburg for other Philadelphia needs.

Katz also said that talk about a regional tax for the stadium was "not realistic."